Majjhima Nikāya 103

Translators: sujato

Middle Discourses 103

Kintisutta

Is This What You Think Of Me?

Evaṁ me sutaṁ—
So I have heard.

ekaṁ samayaṁ bhagavā pisinārāyaṁ viharati baliharaṇe vanasaṇḍe.
At one time the Buddha was staying near Kusinārā, in the Forest of Offerings.

Tatra kho bhagavā bhikkhū āmantesi:
There the Buddha addressed the mendicants,

“bhikkhavo”ti.
“Mendicants!”

“Bhadante”ti te bhikkhū bhagavato paccassosuṁ.
“Venerable sir,” they replied.

Bhagavā etadavoca:
The Buddha said this:

“kinti vo, bhikkhave, mayi hoti:
“Mendicants, is this what you think of me?

‘cīvarahetu vā samaṇo gotamo dhammaṁ deseti, piṇḍapātahetu vā samaṇo gotamo dhammaṁ deseti, senāsanahetu vā samaṇo gotamo dhammaṁ deseti, itibhavābhavahetu vā samaṇo gotamo dhammaṁ desetī’”ti?
‘The ascetic Gotama teaches the Dhamma for the sake of robes, almsfood, lodgings, or rebirth in this or that state.’”

“Na kho no, bhante, bhagavati evaṁ hoti:
“No sir, we don’t think of you that way.”

“Na ca kira vo, bhikkhave, mayi evaṁ hoti:
“If you don’t think of me that way,

‘cīvarahetu vā samaṇo gotamo dhammaṁ deseti …pe…

itibhavābhavahetu vā samaṇo gotamo dhammaṁ desetī’ti;

atha kinti carahi vo, bhikkhave, mayi hotī”ti?
then what exactly do you think of me?”

“Evaṁ kho no, bhante, bhagavati hoti:
“We think of you this way:

‘anukampako bhagavā hitesī;
‘The Buddha is sympathetic and wants what’s best for us.

anukampaṁ upādāya dhammaṁ desetī’”ti.
He teaches out of sympathy.’”

“Evañca kira vo, bhikkhave, mayi hoti:
“So it seems you think

‘anukampako bhagavā hitesī;

anukampaṁ upādāya dhammaṁ desetī’ti.
that I teach out of sympathy.

Tasmātiha, bhikkhave, ye vo mayā dhammā abhiññā desitā, seyyathidaṁ—
In that case, each and every one of you should train in the things I have taught from my direct knowledge, that is:

cattāro satipaṭṭhānā cattāro sammappadhānā cattāro iddhipādā pañcindriyāni pañca balāni satta bojjhaṅgā ariyo aṭṭhaṅgiko maggo, tattha sabbeheva samaggehi sammodamānehi avivadamānehi sikkhitabbaṁ.
the four kinds of mindfulness meditation, the four right efforts, the four bases of psychic power, the five faculties, the five powers, the seven awakening factors, and the noble eightfold path. You should train in these things in harmony, appreciating each other, without quarreling.

Tesañca vo, bhikkhave, samaggānaṁ sammodamānānaṁ avivadamānānaṁ sikkhataṁ siyaṁsu dve bhikkhū abhidhamme nānāvādā.
As you do so, it may happen that two mendicants disagree about the teaching.

Tatra ce tumhākaṁ evamassa:
Now, you might think,

‘imesaṁ kho āyasmantānaṁ atthato ceva nānaṁ byañjanato ca nānan’ti, tattha yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
‘These two venerables disagree on both the meaning and the phrasing.’ So you should approach whichever mendicant you think is most amenable and say to them:

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato ceva nānaṁ, byañjanato ca nānaṁ.
‘The venerables disagree on the meaning and the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato ceva nānaṁ, byañjanato ca nānaṁ.
such disagreement on the meaning and the phrasing comes to be.

Māyasmanto vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about this.’

Athāparesaṁ ekatopakkhikānaṁ bhikkhūnaṁ yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
Then they should approach whichever mendicant they think is most amenable among those who side with the other party and say to them:

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato ceva nānaṁ, byañjanato ca nānaṁ.
‘The venerables disagree on the meaning and the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato ceva nānaṁ, byañjanato ca nānaṁ.
such disagreement on the meaning and the phrasing comes to be.

Māyasmanto vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about this.’

Iti duggahitaṁ duggahitato dhāretabbaṁ, suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretabbaṁ.
So you should remember what has been incorrectly memorized as incorrectly memorized and what has been correctly memorized as correctly memorized.

Duggahitaṁ duggahitato dhāretvā suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretvā yo dhammo yo vinayo so bhāsitabbo.
Remembering this, you should speak on the teaching and the training.

Tatra ce tumhākaṁ evamassa:
Now, you might think,

‘imesaṁ kho āyasmantānaṁ atthato hi kho nānaṁ, byañjanato sametī’ti, tattha yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
‘These two venerables disagree on the meaning but agree on the phrasing.’ So you should approach whichever mendicant you think is most amenable and say to them:

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato hi nānaṁ, byañjanato sameti.
‘The venerables disagree on the meaning but agree on the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato hi kho nānaṁ, byañjanato sameti.
such disagreement on the meaning and agreement on the phrasing comes to be.

Māyasmanto vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about this.’

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato hi kho nānaṁ, byañjanato sameti.
‘The venerables disagree on the meaning but agree on the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato hi kho nānaṁ, byañjanato sameti.
such disagreement on the meaning and agreement on the phrasing comes to be.

Māyasmanto vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about this.’

Duggahitaṁ duggahitato dhāretvā suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretvā yo dhammo yo vinayo so bhāsitabbo.
Remembering this, you should speak on the teaching and the training.

Tatra ce tumhākaṁ evamassa:
Now, you might think,

‘imesaṁ kho āyasmantānaṁ atthato hi kho sameti, byañjanato nānan’ti, tattha yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
‘These two venerables agree on the meaning but disagree on the phrasing.’ So you should approach whichever mendicant you think is most amenable and say to them:

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato hi sameti, byañjanato nānaṁ.
‘The venerables agree on the meaning but disagree on the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato hi kho sameti, byañjanato nānaṁ.
such agreement on the meaning and disagreement on the phrasing comes to be.

Appamattakaṁ kho panetaṁ yadidaṁ—byañjanaṁ.
But the phrasing is a minor matter.

Māyasmanto appamattake vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about something so minor.’

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato hi sameti, byañjanato nānaṁ.
‘The venerables agree on the meaning but disagree on the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato hi kho sameti, byañjanato nānaṁ.
such agreement on the meaning and disagreement on the phrasing comes to be.

Appamattakaṁ kho panetaṁ yadidaṁ—byañjanaṁ.
But the phrasing is a minor matter.

Māyasmanto appamattake vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about something so minor.’

Iti suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretabbaṁ, duggahitaṁ duggahitato dhāretabbaṁ.
So you should remember what has been correctly memorized as correctly memorized and what has been incorrectly memorized as incorrectly memorized.

Suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretvā duggahitaṁ duggahitato dhāretvā yo dhammo yo vinayo so bhāsitabbo.
Remembering this, you should speak on the teaching and the training.

Tatra ce tumhākaṁ evamassa:
Now, you might think,

‘imesaṁ kho āyasmantānaṁ atthato ceva sameti byañjanato ca sametī’ti, tattha yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
‘These two venerables agree on both the meaning and the phrasing.’ So you should approach whichever mendicant you think is most amenable and say to them:

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato ceva sameti, byañjanato ca sameti.
‘The venerables agree on both the meaning and the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato ceva sameti byañjanato ca sameti.
they come to agree on the meaning and the phrasing.

Māyasmanto vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about this.’

‘āyasmantānaṁ kho atthato ceva sameti byañjanato ca sameti.
‘The venerables agree on both the meaning and the phrasing.

Tadamināpetaṁ āyasmanto jānātha—
But the venerables should know that this is how

yathā atthato ceva sameti byañjanato ca sameti.
they come to agree on the meaning and the phrasing.

Māyasmanto vivādaṁ āpajjitthā’ti.
Please don’t get into a dispute about this.’

Iti suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretabbaṁ.
So you should remember what has been correctly memorized as correctly memorized.

Suggahitaṁ suggahitato dhāretvā yo dhammo yo vinayo so bhāsitabbo.
Remembering this, you should speak on the teaching and the training.

Tesañca vo, bhikkhave, samaggānaṁ sammodamānānaṁ avivadamānānaṁ sikkhataṁ siyā aññatarassa bhikkhuno āpatti siyā vītikkamo,
As you train in harmony, appreciating each other, without quarreling, one of the mendicants might commit an offense or transgression.

tatra, bhikkhave, na codanāya taritabbaṁ. Puggalo upaparikkhitabbo:
In such a case, you should not be in a hurry to accuse them. The individual should be examined like this:

‘iti mayhañca avihesā bhavissati parassa ca puggalassa anupaghāto, paro hi puggalo akkodhano anupanāhī adaḷhadiṭṭhī suppaṭinissaggī, sakkomi cāhaṁ etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetun’ti.
‘I won’t be troubled and the other individual won’t be hurt, for they’re not irritable and acrimonious. They don’t hold fast to their views, but let them go easily. I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.’

Sace, bhikkhave, evamassa, kallaṁ vacanāya.
If that’s what you think, then it’s appropriate to speak to them.

Sace pana, bhikkhave, evamassa:
But suppose you think this:

‘mayhaṁ kho avihesā bhavissati parassa ca puggalassa upaghāto, paro hi puggalo kodhano upanāhī adaḷhadiṭṭhī suppaṭinissaggī, sakkomi cāhaṁ etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetuṁ.
‘I will be troubled and the other individual will be hurt, for they’re irritable and acrimonious. However, they don’t hold fast to their views, but let them go easily. I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.

Appamattakaṁ kho panetaṁ yadidaṁ—parassa puggalassa upaghāto.
But for the other individual to get hurt is a minor matter.

Atha kho etadeva bahutaraṁ—
It’s more important

svāhaṁ sakkomi etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetun’ti.
that I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.’

Sace, bhikkhave, evamassa, kallaṁ vacanāya.
If that’s what you think, then it’s appropriate to speak to them.

Sace pana, bhikkhave, evamassa:
But suppose you think this:

‘mayhaṁ kho vihesā bhavissati parassa ca puggalassa anupaghāto. Paro hi puggalo akkodhano anupanāhī daḷhadiṭṭhī duppaṭinissaggī, sakkomi cāhaṁ etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetuṁ.
‘I will be troubled but the other individual won’t be hurt, for they’re not irritable and acrimonious. However, they hold fast to their views, refusing to let go. Nevertheless, I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.

Appamattakaṁ kho panetaṁ yadidaṁ—mayhaṁ vihesā.
But for me to be troubled is a minor matter.

Atha kho etadeva bahutaraṁ—
It’s more important

svāhaṁ sakkomi etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetun’ti.
that I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.’

Sace, bhikkhave, evamassa, kallaṁ vacanāya.
If that’s what you think, then it’s appropriate to speak to them.

Sace pana, bhikkhave, evamassa:
But suppose you think this:

‘mayhañca kho vihesā bhavissati parassa ca puggalassa upaghāto. Paro hi puggalo kodhano upanāhī daḷhadiṭṭhī duppaṭinissaggī, sakkomi cāhaṁ etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetuṁ.
‘I will be troubled and the other individual will be hurt, for they’re irritable and acrimonious. And they hold fast to their views, refusing to let go. Nevertheless, I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.

Appamattakaṁ kho panetaṁ yadidaṁ—mayhañca vihesā bhavissati parassa ca puggalassa upaghāto.
But for me to be troubled and the other individual to get hurt is a minor matter.

Atha kho etadeva bahutaraṁ—
It’s more important

svāhaṁ sakkomi etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetun’ti.
that I can draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.’

Sace, bhikkhave, evamassa, kallaṁ vacanāya.
If that’s what you think, then it’s appropriate to speak to them.

Sace pana, bhikkhave, evamassa:
But suppose you think this:

‘mayhañca kho vihesā bhavissati parassa ca puggalassa upaghāto. Paro hi puggalo kodhano upanāhī daḷhadiṭṭhī duppaṭinissaggī, na cāhaṁ sakkomi etaṁ puggalaṁ akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpetun’ti.
‘I will be troubled and the other individual will be hurt, for they’re irritable and acrimonious. And they hold fast to their views, refusing to let go. I cannot draw them away from the unskillful and establish them in the skillful.’

Evarūpe, bhikkhave, puggale upekkhā nātimaññitabbā.
Don’t underestimate the value of equanimity regarding such a person.

Tesañca vo, bhikkhave, samaggānaṁ sammodamānānaṁ avivadamānānaṁ sikkhataṁ aññamaññassa vacīsaṁhāro uppajjeyya diṭṭhipaḷāso cetaso āghāto appaccayo anabhiraddhi.
As you train in harmony, appreciating each other, without quarreling, the sides might continue to bring up settled issues with each other, with contempt for each other’s views, resentful, bitter, and exasperated.

Tattha ekatopakkhikānaṁ bhikkhūnaṁ yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
In this case you should approach whichever mendicant you think is most amenable among those who side with one party and say to them:

‘yaṁ no, āvuso, amhākaṁ samaggānaṁ sammodamānānaṁ avivadamānānaṁ sikkhataṁ aññamaññassa vacīsaṁhāro uppanno diṭṭhipaḷāso cetaso āghāto appaccayo anabhiraddhi, taṁ jānamāno samaṇo garaheyyā’ti.
‘Reverend, as we were training, the sides continued to bring up settled issues with each other. If the Ascetic knew about this, would he criticize it?’

Sammā byākaramāno, bhikkhave, bhikkhu evaṁ byākareyya:
Answering rightly, the mendicant should say:

Etaṁ panāvuso, dhammaṁ appahāya nibbānaṁ sacchikareyyā’ti.
‘But without giving that up, reverend, can one realize extinguishment?’

Sammā byākaramāno, bhikkhave, bhikkhu evaṁ byākareyya:
Answering rightly, the mendicant should say:

‘etaṁ, āvuso, dhammaṁ appahāya na nibbānaṁ sacchikareyyā’ti.
‘No, reverend, one cannot.’

Athāparesaṁ ekatopakkhikānaṁ bhikkhūnaṁ yaṁ bhikkhuṁ suvacataraṁ maññeyyātha, so upasaṅkamitvā evamassa vacanīyo:
Then they should approach whichever mendicant they think is most amenable among those who side with the other party and say to them:

Sammā byākaramāno, bhikkhave, bhikkhu evaṁ byākareyya:
Answering rightly, the mendicant should say:

‘yaṁ no, āvuso, amhākaṁ samaggānaṁ sammodamānānaṁ avivadamānānaṁ sikkhataṁ aññamaññassa vacīsaṁhāro uppanno diṭṭhipaḷāso cetaso āghāto appaccayo anabhiraddhi taṁ jānamāno samaṇo garaheyyāti.
‘Yes, reverend, he would.’

Etaṁ panāvuso, dhammaṁ appahāya nibbānaṁ sacchikareyyā’ti.
‘But without giving that up, reverend, can one realize extinguishment?’

Sammā byākaramāno, bhikkhave, bhikkhu evaṁ byākareyya:
Answering rightly, the mendicant should say:

‘etaṁ kho, āvuso, dhammaṁ appahāya na nibbānaṁ sacchikareyyā’ti.
‘No, reverend, one cannot.’

Tañce, bhikkhave, bhikkhuṁ pare evaṁ puccheyyuṁ:
If others should ask that mendicant:

‘āyasmatā no ete bhikkhū akusalā vuṭṭhāpetvā kusale patiṭṭhāpitā’ti?
‘Were you the venerable who drew those mendicants away from the unskillful and established them in the skillful?’

Sammā byākaramāno, bhikkhave, bhikkhu evaṁ byākareyya:
Answering rightly, the mendicant should say:

‘idhāhaṁ, āvuso, yena bhagavā tenupasaṅkamiṁ, tassa me bhagavā dhammaṁ desesi, tāhaṁ dhammaṁ sutvā tesaṁ bhikkhūnaṁ abhāsiṁ.
‘Well, reverends, I approached the Buddha. He taught me the Dhamma. After hearing that teaching I explained it to those mendicants.

Taṁ te bhikkhū dhammaṁ sutvā akusalā vuṭṭhahiṁsu, kusale patiṭṭhahiṁsū’ti.
When those mendicants heard that teaching they were drawn away from the unskillful and established in the skillful.’

Evaṁ byākaramāno kho, bhikkhave, bhikkhu na ceva attānaṁ ukkaṁseti, na paraṁ vambheti, dhammassa cānudhammaṁ byākaroti, na ca koci sahadhammiko vādānuvādo gārayhaṁ ṭhānaṁ āgacchatī”ti.
Answering in this way, that mendicant doesn’t glorify themselves or put others down. They answer in line with the teaching, with no legitimate grounds for rebuttal and criticism.”

Idamavoca bhagavā.
That is what the Buddha said.

Attamanā te bhikkhū bhagavato bhāsitaṁ abhinandunti.
Satisfied, the mendicants approved what the Buddha said.

Kintisuttaṁ niṭṭhitaṁ tatiyaṁ.